... are not always logical (nor is there even universal agreement on what they should be). For example, applying the rules as you stated them, John:

>> "Is this still Las Vegas?" Gene asked. << is clearly correct. But:

>> Did Gene say, "Is this still Las Vegas"? << Why isn't this sentence punctuated as follows: Did Gene say, "Is this still Las Vegas?"? <g>

After all, the quoted material IS a question and your rule "question mark and exclamation mark are enclosed within quotation marks if they apply to the quoted material" would appear to apply.

BUT, the entire sentence is also a question and your rule "they are placed after the quotation marks ONLY if they apply to the whole sentence" would ALSO seem to apply. Hence, TWO question marks!!

Or consider this: if the sentence:

>> Did Gene say, "Is this still Las Vegas"? <<

is properly punctuated, why would this one be punctuated this way:

Gene said, "This is still Las Vegas."

Why is the period always inside the quotation, even if it applies to the whole sentence, but the question mark and exclamation point outside if they apply to the whole sentence?

To take an example from the book "The Handbook of Good English" (the title of the book should really be in italics or underlined, but I don't know how to do either on the BB! <g>), the sentence:

I'm not sure what is meant by "fail safe."

is properly puncuated according to normal convention. But, the period applies to the whole sentence. Why isn't it:

I'm not sure what is meant by "fail safe".

which would be more logical?

The explanation for this, according to the book, is:

"The answer has nothing to do with logic. In the days of hand-set type, supposedly, printers discovered that a period handing out at the end of a sentence after a quotation mark was easily knocked awry, and they solved the problem by putting the period and the comman within the closing quotation mark regardless of logic. Now this arbitrary positioning of the quotation mark is the universal American convention."

The handbook, BTW, also notes that in Britain they punctuate logically, rather than according to our convention. Personally, I use the logical approach, regardless of the illogical American rules.

As for emoticons, I basically agree with Larry's approach. If they emoticon falls in the middle of a sentence <g>, I just put it there. If it applies to the entire sentence or paragraph, I put it at the end, after the period. <g>

Interesting question, John. Gives us something to talk about besides the number of days until the turn of the new millennium! <BG> ----- jim o\-S