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The Chip Board Archive 02

Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...

As noted elsewhere, the annual club auction previously allowed minimums & hidden reserves to be placed on lots submitted for auction. One year, a number or lots went unsold because they failed to reach the reserve set by the seller. The proceeds to the club for an unsold lot is $0. As a major fundraising vehicle, an auction with a number of unsold lots doesn't contribute to the club coffers. And so the "no reserves" change was instituted. (At least that's the history as I understood it; I wasn't privy to any inside discussions.)

Since the "no reserves" change, I thought the rule was that any seller could place an INTITIAL bid on their lot, with the understanding that if no other bids came in, they bought back their lot, and must pay both buyers and sellers fees. I didn't think that seller (or a shiller) bids were permitted beyond an optional INITIAL bid by the seller. (However, I may not have fully understood the latitude permitted, since I never intended to place a bid on any of my items anyway.)

Also, [from another post] it's not quite correct to say that a seller pays a 20% premium if he bids on and wins his own lot. He's already on the hook for the 10% seller's premium regardless of outcome. It's only the extra 10% buyer's premium that's additional if a seller wins his own lot. As a hypothetical example, if a seller truly believes a chip would fetch $200 on the convention floor on the day after the convention, he would be rational in bidding (initially or subsequently, whatever the rules permit) up to prox. $170, if the auction bidding does not reach that level. Reason: at $170, he must pay 20% total fees, or $34; but he just bought (from himself) a chip for $170 that he can turn around and sell for $200, or a $30 profit, so it's nearly a wash ($34 fee vs. $30 profit). This assumes the seller is very sure that the chip will sell later for $200.

Personally, I have no problems with the current structure, especially since the auction is a fundraising vehicle for the club. If minimums and/or reserves are re-introduced at some point, I think an "unsold lot" fee should be instituted. Haven't thought what a "fair" percentage would be -- I'll leave that to others with more experience.

Messages In This Thread

Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
The published rules do not prohibit ...
Re: The published rules do not prohibit ...
Re: The published rules do not prohibit ...
I'm still not convinced that ...
Re: I'm still not convinced that ...
Damn... There goes my free beer (NT)
Re: Damn... There goes ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Archie, the club auction may be ...
Re: President Sarles; the club auction may be ...
Re: President Sarles; the club auction may be ...
Re: President Sarles; the club auction may be ...
Archie, this post warrants ...
Further response ...
Re: Further response ...
See my response to Jim Kruse ...
Re: See my response to Jim Kruse ...
Precisely correct on this point ...
Re: Four things ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
Wasn't really trying to bring about ...
See marv Weaver's excellent post ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...
You have made some excellent POINTS ...
Re: Auction Shill Bidding -- THE POINT ...

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