And don't forget the 6 or 8 has the same odds as the Pass, Don't Pass, Come or Don't come. After that, the rest of the layout doesn't exist. <G>

If they guy mentioned was a good counted, he could have been "Wanging" the table. The player stands and watches until the count is good. Sits and hits the table and moves on.

As pretty much everyone agrees, it takes lots of work and practice to be a counter. Not worth the effort as far as I'm concerned. I'll sit and play awhile, but as soon as I'm up $40, I'll head for the crap table. Hit and run is the only way.