Hey Alan,

A couple of years ago, Robert Cook (WILCOX Enterprises), myself, and along with a few others tried working on a numbering system. We didn't get very far, as the main problem is coming up with a system that is not only easy to understand, yet easy enough for the "new" collector (and old ones) to learn/use.

My concerns are as follows:
1) That assigning a "string" (defined as numbers and/or characters) to a casino, then adding additional "strings" for the denomination; condition; Color; issuance; etc may be a bit much for people to swallow or understand - it requires a lot of memorization.

2) Who is the keeper or who establishes these numbers - with the exploding number of "limited editions" as well as the ever increasing number of new casinos - how are the members of the club to be informed (in a timely manor) as to the new number that has been assigned to each of these new chips?

3) One thing that may generate a lot of conversations is 'which issue came before what' other one, it may be very difficult to establish/verify precisely the order of issuance, since most casinos may not be interested in publishing this information. Not to mention the casinos that are closed...

4) Once a "string" has been assigned to all known chips, and a "new" issue is found - (e.g. look at TCR #5 Vs TCR #6 for the Aladdin 50c chips. TCR #5 listed 2, now in TCR #6 there are four) does the "committee" then assign a lower number to the "new find" or a higher one or worse add a new character to the ever growing string!?! This will either cause confusion, or turn into just a quasi-random number generator (with a very long seed and result!).

5) How are variations handled? In the TCR they have the same number as the first variety that was entered into TCR database, except that the leading character changed from a "N" to a "V". Some variations can be easily described in text, as the authors of the TCR did, and in other cases where it isn't easy to describe in text, a picture was added in the photo section (Did I mention that I LIKE this new feature in TCR!!! WAY TO GO KMW!!!).
Adding of a new field only adds to the confusion factor...

6) How far are the variations going to be "accepted" - e.g. Reverse edge insert colors as seen on some Paulson chips that have a different image on either side of the chip; Reverse edge text as seen on various CHIPCO chips; not to mention the UV issue in general. LUXOR has seven "common" UV $1 chips: Nile, CIRCUS CICRUS, LUXOR, TUT, Pyramid, Egypt and Blank (other $1 chips are known to have some combination of two of the fore mentioned UV markings, one on each side - such as CIRCUS CIRCUS on one side and LUXOR on the other). Also the UV H&C logo (or absence of the UV logo) on Paulson chips. There are several styles of the UV H&C: the size; flat bottom Vs Curved Bottom of the hat; UV H&C with date, etc...). Not to mention Bud Jones, there are different styles of the UV BJ.
Some people will not collect manufacturer's manufacturing process "anomalies" - yet some do - are these to be left out???
Or just plan error chips - different denominations on each side, missing or extra edge inserts. Are these also going to have a special "string"???

7) Another Concern along these lines is how are the casinos in countries other than the USA, going to be "cataloged" - who/how are their issuance "strings" going to be assigned here?

8) How are the "illegal" clubs going to be handled - how is the issuance going to be determined here? By whom? Not to mention that some of the illegal chips were played in various places.

9) Along those lines - several card clubs here in California use chips from other card clubs that are closed, or from some other closed casinos (including some from Nevada...). Do these chips now have multiple numbers - one for each location that they were used in? (recall that each casino has been assigned a unique identifying number...)

10) Along the lines of what Andy asked with respect to TCR Numbers, what about Dale Seymour's numbering system for the "poker" chips - as it is possible that some of the chips illustrated in his book may have been used in either illegal or legal casinos/card clubs? - not to mention our favorite Cyber Guide numbers?!? Or the numbers that Allen Banick uses in his Colorado Chip Exchange? Or the numbing system used by the Herz's book the Nevada Gaming Checks & Chips
Most of these numbering systems have been easy to understand - most are quasi-random numbers - very easy to use/understand not to mention that they are either published and/or are available on-line.
Some collectors, myself included, have come up with their own numbering system for their databases. The one I use is simple. As seen on the images I've posted on this BB, as well as on the various pages on my web sites, it has the form of:
AAXXXXXB - where the AA is the state of country code(NV = Nevada, CO = Colorado, etc), XXXXX is a hex number (00000 through FFFFF for a total number of 1,048,576 different chips for EACH state/country code). The last character denotes Obverse/Reverse of the chips (if the two sides are different) as well as the scan size, these include:
3 = 360 dpi scan of the "Obverse"
O = 100 dpi scan of the "Obverse"
R = 100 dpi scan of the "Reverse"
X = 360 dpi scan of the "Reverse"
By NO means am I proposing that my numbering system is any better that anyone else's - it described it here just to illustrate a point, that there is a number of numbering systems.

The end result of the conversations with Robert Cook & Company was that there really wasn't a common numbering system that everyone could easily learn/understand.

I don't want the outcome of the conversations that have had transpired in the past generate a lot of negative "karma" on this attempt - yet I'm not convinced that any one solution will be easily understood or accepted or used by all.

I'm afraid that unless the various authorities - Authors of TCR, Cyber Guide, Colorado Chip Exchange, Nevada Gaming Checks & Chips ,etc. are convinced and change their publications and/or sites, a general numbering system may find it very difficult to be adopted for universal use.

Just my 2 cents...

Dick